For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ããThanks.ãããã... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 07:52 pmãã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã > ã > Thanks.ã > ã > ã > ããI got started with screen, but nowadays I use tmux more often. The main reasonãis that it is in OpenBSD's base install, so I just got used to it. It is alsoãlicensed under a BSD-like license, if you care about such things. In addition,ãits keyboard commands are a bit easier for my fingers.ããIn the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.ããã--ãgopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalkenãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Hi Gamgee,

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".
And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)

Regards,
Anna

---
ï¿­ Synchronet ï¿­ Imzadi Box -*- box.imzadi.de

I use tmux... I has a status bar that's useful to check the session id
and it's easier.


On 29/04/2021 21:52, Gamgee wrote:

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

---
ï¿­ Synchronet ï¿­ Baffa BBS... from old times...

Arelor wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ãã Ar> I got started with screen, but nowadays I use tmux more often.ã Ar> The main reason is that it is in OpenBSD's base install, so Iã Ar> just got used to it. It is also licensed under a BSD-likeã Ar> license, if you care about such things. In addition, its keyboardã Ar> commands are a bit easier for my fingers.ããOkay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always used ãscreen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does have ãsome VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially like ãbeing able to have more than one "window" available (proper term might ãbe "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is very ãcool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.ãã Ar> In the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.ããHehe, I suppose that is probably true. Nano for the win. ;-)ãããã... Alimony: Bounty on the Mutinyã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

acn wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ãã ac> I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned firstã ac> and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which areã ac> mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from myã ac> SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shellã ac> commands in parallel".ããYeah, same here. Take a look at tmux if you get bored, it has some ãpretty cool features that go a little beyond screen. I still mostly use ãscreen too, but will likely move to tmux eventually.ãã ac> And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)ããYep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremely ãawkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)ãããã... Time flies like an arrow -- fruit flies like a banana.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Abaffa wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Ab> I use tmux... I has a status bar that's useful to check theã Ab> session id and it's easier.ããYep, I like that too. Thanks for the reply.ãããã... Press any key to continue or any other key to quitã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to acn on Fri Apr 30 2021 07:46 amãã > Yep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremelyã > awkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)ããYeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn't all that often).ã-- ã digital manããRush quote #61:ãHe's a rebel and a runner, he's a signal turning green .. New World ManãNorco, CA WX: 90.9øF, 17.0% humidity, 8 mph E wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrsã---ã þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.netã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to Arelor on Fri Apr 30 2021 07:43 amãã Ga> Okay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always used ã Ga> screen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does have ã Ga> some VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially like ã Ga> being able to have more than one "window" available (proper term might ã Ga> be "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is very ã Ga> cool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.ããI'm with you on this.ããI've been using screen for a loooong time, but discovered tmuxinator for the MAC, with some themes, which provides a nice sexy screen.ããSo I'm in the process of switching over to tmux and having to learn the tmux way of things - all because of a sexy screen!ããI'm probably using 2% of it right now, and its on my list to understand it more, but thats enough for me to be dangerous now.ãã...ëîåïãã... Money can't buy friends but you can get a better class of enemy.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!ã

Gamgee wrote:ã> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã> ããI use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.comã

Digital Man wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã > Yep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremelyã > awkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)ãã DM> Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it'sã DM> the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn'tã DM> all that often).ããHard to believe that *anyone* would actually prefer Ctrl-B... :-)ããYou probably already know this, but you can "permanently" define your ãdesired prefix key in a config file (Linux "dotfile") called .tmux.confããMy very simple config looks like this:ãã# remap prefix from 'C-b' to 'C-a'ãunbind C-bãset-option -g prefix C-aãbind-key C-a send-prefixãã# split panes using | and -ãbind | split-window -hãbind - split-window -vãunbind '"'ãunbind %ãã# switch panes using Alt-arrow without prefixãbind -n M-Left select-pane -Lãbind -n M-Right select-pane -Rãbind -n M-Up select-pane -Uãbind -n M-Down select-pane -Dããã... Enter any 12 digit prime number to continue.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

deon wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Ga> Okay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always usedã Ga> screen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does haveã Ga> some VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially likeã Ga> being able to have more than one "window" available (proper term mightã Ga> be "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is veryã Ga> cool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.ãã de> I'm with you on this.ãã de> I've been using screen for a loooong time, but discoveredã de> tmuxinator for the MAC, with some themes, which provides a niceã de> sexy screen.ãã de> So I'm in the process of switching over to tmux and having toã de> learn the tmux way of things - all because of a sexy screen!ããCosmetic appeal is very important to most people. I don't use a Mac, ãbut I bet it looks good!ãã de> I'm probably using 2% of it right now, and its on my list toã de> understand it more, but thats enough for me to be dangerous now.ããI'm in the same place. I really like it and am going to get better at ãusing it, at least the basics. The multi-pane stuff (split windows) is ãespecially attractive to me.ããã... How do they get Teflon to stick to the pans?ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Nelgin wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ãã Ne> I use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.ããYeah, I've always looked at it that way too. The thing is, once you see ãsome of the features that can be used, you start to wonder "How did I ãever get by without this?" :-)ããThe split-window options are excellent. CLI multitasking. Hahahaããã... Something will have to be done, something irresponsible.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and itã ac> works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep aã ac> session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use aã ac> single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".ã ac> And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)ããI'm jumping in here, and apologies for such. :P ããI do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.ããI think I can... SSH into my BBS box and say, run the server.. and if I close the SSH window it'll keep the server open on the BBS Box side? ããWould you mind explaining a quick overview of what screen is? And used for? Possibly how it help sysOps running a BBS on another system on their network.ããAlso, pls know that I'm 'man screen'ing right now... :P ãããã|07p|15AULIE|1142|07oã|08.........ã

On 01 May 2021, paulie420 said the following...ã ã pa> I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed toã pa> do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side ofã pa> screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.ããtraditionally when a process's controlling terminal closes, the programs running in it close. so yeah, like if your ssh session were to disconnect because the power went out, what you were currently doing would abruptly end. this could be particularly annoying if you were doing something like compiling firefox ;) (from remote i guess so the server still had power lol)ããso now screen/tmux take the role of controlling terminal and have specialãhandling for that event.ããthis probably mattered more when these machines were actually multiuser (as in actual people) and resources were scarce. there are a few public *nix machines out there that do still limit users to one process running while they're not logged in (or one + tmux).ãã--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/04/20 (Windows/32)ã * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, miã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Digital Man to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 04:57 pmãã DM> Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn'tã DM> all that often).ããWhat does Ctrl-B do in vi?ãã(Learning something new about vi every day, and I've only been using it since forever..)ãã...ëîåïãã... True love is when you spend œ50 for an operation on a œ5 dog.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!ã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: paulie420 to acn on Sat May 01 2021 10:31 amããHey Paulie,ãã pa> I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on the left sideã pa> of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.ããThe main reason I started using it is for disconnected sessions.ããI can jump into a box, do some work, disconnect, comeback later, re-connect and see what happened.ããIn the old modem dialup internet days (or iffy internet connections), this was a saviour.ããThese days, I work at my desk on an iMac, or sit in front of the TV with a MacBook - and I can "switch" to either and continue where I left off.ããThe other benefit, especially when developing, one window "pane" is the tail of a debug log file, while another is an interface into the DB and the 3rd where I'm watching incoming HTTP requests. I can zoom into any pane to see more content, or have all 3 on the screen at once while I'm trying to figure out why an API call is failing.ãã ãã...ëîåïãã... Chuck Norris counted to infinity - twice.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!ã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 09:48 amãã > Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã > By: Digital Man to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 04:57 pmã >ã > DM> Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's theã > DM> first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn'tã > DM> all that often).ã >ã > What does Ctrl-B do in vi?ããScrolls backward (Ctrl-F for forward).ãã > (Learning something new about vi every day, and I've only been using itã > since forever..)ããOh, I know there's plenty about vi/vim I still don't know.ããOne thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.ã-- ã digital manããRush quote #23:ãPlus ca change, plus c'est la meme choseãNorco, CA WX: 70.5øF, 57.0% humidity, 10 mph NE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrsã---ã þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.netã

traditionally when a process's controlling terminal closes, the programsã fu> running in it close. so yeah, like if your ssh session were to disconnectã fu> because the power went out, what you were currently doing would abruptlyã fu> end. this could be particularly annoying if you were doing somethingã fu> like compiling firefox ;) (from remote i guess so the server still hadã fu> power lol)ããUnderstood - and is there a way to get back to that process again, from either the host OS or a new remote ssh (or whatever)? And... if thats the ENTIRE thing, as stated, I can man it... just chit chatting. :Pãããã|07p|15AULIE|1142|07oã|08.........ã

The main reason I started using it is for disconnected sessions.ã de> ã de> I can jump into a box, do some work, disconnect, comeback later,ã de> re-connect and see what happened.ããAwesome. I just asked another posted this question - and thanks.. so it seems like I *need* to brush up on and learn to use screen. As you stated, it sounds like a saviour - and I've USED it before when... told to; but I didn't grasp it. ããI will after today, however. :P Thanks all.ãThanks Deon.ãããã|07p|15AULIE|1142|07oã|08.........ã

paulie420 wrote to acn <=-ãã ac> I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and itã ac> works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep aã ac> session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use aã ac> single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".ã ac> And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)ãã pa> I'm jumping in here, and apologies for such. :PããJumping in is allowed, and encouraged!ãã pa> I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that Iã pa> needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on theã pa> left side of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its usesã pa> ARE.ãã pa> I think I can... SSH into my BBS box and say, run the server..ã pa> and if I close the SSH window it'll keep the server open on theã pa> BBS Box side?ããYes.ãã pa> Would you mind explaining a quick overview of what screen is? Andã pa> used for? Possibly how it help sysOps running a BBS on anotherã pa> system on their network.ããIt's a terminal multiplexer. It allows you to connect into a remote ãsystem, open a screen session (terminal), and run something in that ãterminal. You can then "detach" from that screen session, close your ãSSH connection, and go on with whatever else you might be doing. Later, ãyou can SSH back to that machine, and "reconnect" to that open terminal ãwhich is still running whatever you started in it.ããHere's an example of one way that I use it. I have an Raspberry Pi ãrunning 24x7, which does various things for me (it does not run my BBS ãthough). I SSH to it from my laptop (either from within the LAN, or ãremotely from another state if I'm traveling). I have opened a screen ãsession on it, and started the 'irssi' IRC client in that terminal. ãThis connects and idles in the Synchronet IRC channel. I then can ãdetach from that session (with Ctrl-A, D), and close my SSH connection. ãA few hours, or a few days later, I can SSH back to the RPi, restore my ãscreen session (with "screen -r"), and BAM! my irssi client is there ãwhere I can scroll back and see what's been talked about while I was ãgone. Maybe I add some comments, whatever. Then I detach and close ãagain, and the irssi client continues running while I'm gone. This ãallows me to maintain a "presence" in that channel even if I'm not ãactively watching it for a while, and I can catch up when it's ãconvenient for me. You can open as many screen sessions on a remote ãhost as you'd like, all doing something different, and all will keep on ãworking after you detach. Pretty cool stuff.ãã pa> Also, pls know that I'm 'man screen'ing right now... :PããGood call!ãããã... Toto, I don't think we're in DOS any more...ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Digital Man to deon on Sat May 01 2021 05:47 pmãã >> What does Ctrl-B do in vi?ã DM> Scrolls backward (Ctrl-F for forward).ããAhh, ofcourse - I have used it sometimes but not that often.ãã DM> One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.ããSo I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy ! ãã...ëîåïãã... I used to be an agnostic, but now I'm not so sure.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!ã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 13:08:42ãã DM>> One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit editã DM>> mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.ãã de> So I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy ! ããYou still have to "ESC" before you can :x if you're in edit/insert mode. That's what the ctrl-[ is helpful for.. Interesingly enough, my ESC key is broken, so other than using an on-screen keyboard, I've had to figure this out lately... ;-)ããBoonDockãã* El Gato de Fuego * The Fire Cat * Pedasi, Panamaãã... The cause of problems are solutions!ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ El Gato de Fuego - Pedasi, Panama - gatofueg.synchro.netã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: BoonDock to deon on Sun May 02 2021 12:30 amããHowdy,ãã Bo> You still have to "ESC" before you can :x if you're in edit/insert mode. That's what the ctrl-[ is helpful for.. Interesingly enough,ã Bo> my ESC key is broken, so other than using an on-screen keyboard, I've had to figure this out lately... ;-)ããSo you do. Its muscle memory for me and I do it without thinking about it.ãã...ëîåïãã... Diplomacy: The patriotic art of lying for one's country.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!ã

Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 19:52:00ããohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable, customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it to do. You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot with tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.ãããã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã >ã > Thanks.ã >ã >ã >ã > ... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Baffa BBS... from old times...ã

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed toã pa> do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side ofã pa> screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.ããMy two use cases are Weechat and Minecraft Server seems to want to runãin foreground, it does make it easy to connect back to MC server and issueãcommands. Apart from that I do prefer to run things as background processes.ããRenMasãã--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)ã * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.netã

Jimmy Mac wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã JM> Re: Screen or tmux?ã JM> By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 19:52:00ãã JM> ohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable,ã JM> customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it toã JM> do. You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot withã JM> tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.ããInteresting..... thanks.ãããã... If it weren't for Edison we'd be using computers by candlelightã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Jimmy Mac wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã JM> @MSGID: <608E25EC.21.dove-unix@baffa.zapto.org>ã JM> @REPLY: <608B54B9.392.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>ã JM> Re: Screen or tmux?ã JM> By: Gamgee to All on Thuã JM> Apr 29 2021 19:52:00ãã JM> ohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable,ã JM> customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it to do.ã JM> You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot withã JM> tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.ãããã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã >ã > Thanks.ã >ã >ã >ããScreen, but only really because that is what I learned and know, and because itãhas zmodem support, which is kind of cool, not because I think it is better.ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

It's a terminal multiplexer. It allows you to connect into a remote ã Ga> system, open a screen session (terminal), and run something in that ã Ga> terminal. You can then "detach" from that screen session, close your ã Ga> SSH connection, and go on with whatever else you might be doing. Later, ã Ga> you can SSH back to that machine, and "reconnect" to that open terminal ã Ga> which is still running whatever you started in it.ããAwesome; what I've learned so far is that I'm missing out by not using one or the other. I know screen a little, so I guess I'll start there.. stupid, too - its exactly what I've needed on many occasions. Derp.ãã Ga> Here's an example of one way that I use it. I have an Raspberry Pi ã Ga> running 24x7, which does various things for me (it does not run my BBS ã Ga> though). I SSH to it from my laptop (either from within the LAN, or ã Ga> remotely from another state if I'm traveling). I have opened a screen ã Ga> session on it, and started the 'irssi' IRC client in that terminal. ã Ga> This connects and idles in the Synchronet IRC channel. I then can ã Ga> detach from that session (with Ctrl-A, D), and close my SSH connection. ã Ga> A few hours, or a few days later, I can SSH back to the RPi, restore my ã Ga> screen session (with "screen -r"), and BAM! my irssi client is there ã Ga> where I can scroll back and see what's been talked about while I was ã Ga> gone. Maybe I add some comments, whatever. Then I detach and close ã Ga> again, and the irssi client continues running while I'm gone. This ã Ga> allows me to maintain a "presence" in that channel even if I'm not ã Ga> actively watching it for a while, and I can catch up when it's ã Ga> convenient for me. You can open as many screen sessions on a remote ã Ga> host as you'd like, all doing something different, and all will keep on ã Ga> working after you detach. Pretty cool stuff.ããYep... awesome. :P I'll be doing the same exact thing shortly. Like I can have one Raspberry Pi that allows me access to my local network and screen around from there. Again, I'll brush up myself but... seems like I can have a few things 'screened' and ... I'm sure theres a way to get a list of whats open on what screens... :P ããI should have investigated this long ago - as I've used it with irssi, too, to put the handle lists on the right hand side of the screen - but I didn't realize that it does much more for the type of computery stuff I do all the time. :P ãã(I'll admit that I've used VNC to do much the same... with a lot more resources that screen would take. Ugh.)ãããã|07p|15AULIE|1142|07oã|08.........ã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 01:08 pmãã > DM> One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.ã >ã > So I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy !ããHow do you exit edit mode?ã-- ã digital manããThis Is Spinal Tap quote #46:ã"Not an Exit" - we don't want an exit. Well that's true.ãNorco, CA WX: 63.9øF, 66.0% humidity, 6 mph ENE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrsã---ã þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.netã

Nelgin wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Ne> I use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.ããI have a love / hate relationship with screen. Even on the best ofãdays, screen breaks emulation when I go between traditional Linux-basedãsystems and AIX. AIX uses vt220/vt320 throughout SMIT (smitty). I'veãgot to the point where I don't use SMIT because the emulation keepsãgetting trashed and have to remember command-line syntaxes that goãupwards of 100 characters. :|ãããBrian Klauss <-> Dream MasterãCaught in a Dream | caughtinadream.com a Synchronet BBSãã... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.ã--- MultiMail/Mac v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Caught in a Dream - caughtinadream.comã

Gamgee wrote to All <=-ãã Ga> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ããTmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game, ãplaying more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple of ãPutty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.ããã... Look at the order in which you do thingsã--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.orgã

Arelor wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Ar> In the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.ããMakes me want to dig up my old geek code block and update it to add a screen ãmultiplexer listing.ãããã... Look at the order in which you do thingsã--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.orgã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Dream Master to Nelgin on Mon May 03 2021 08:13 amããI use picocom. It's got enough command line switches toãwarrant a shell script to launch it.ããWill convert line endings on the fly; supports ascii-xfr.ããI use it to talk to microcontrollers via USART or USBã(CDC/ACM stuff).ããI have no idea if it'll telnet or ssh.ããSometimes I'll try tinyfugue by .. I don't remember .. atãsome point I'm pretty sure I need to be listening for telnetãinbound connections to use tinyfugue effectively (because itãwas designed to talk to telnet destinations such as LambdaMOO).ããSo I probably /world localhost or similar to telnet to theã(Linux) locahost. When I get a shell prompt (split screen,ãlike IRSSI for example) I can then ssh out to a BBS on theãInternet.ããSCREEN is great if you have a shell account on someone else'sãmachine, because of the detach/attach feature; it lets youãstay logged into a BBS that doesn't time out your session,ãeven when your modem has dropped carrier (including shuttingãdown a DSL modem for any reason you may want to do so).ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ My Brand-New BBSã

poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Ga> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ãã pF> Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to theã pF> game, playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used toã pF> open a couple of Putty sessions, I can now do everything with oneã pF> session and Tmux.ããWell, to be fair, it sounds like you could also do that with one session ãand screen.ããThe question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?ãããã... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-ãã Ga> The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?ãã<flips coin>ããI'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on using tmux. ãOnce I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled* with helpful ãweb sites outlining how to use it.ããããã... Change ambiguities to specificsã--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.orgã

poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã pF> @MSGID: <609333BF.2679.dove.dove-nix@realitycheckbbs.org>ã pF> @REPLY: <60919499.428.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>ã -=> Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-ãã Ga> The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?ãã pF> <flips coin>ãã pF> I'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on usingã pF> tmux. Once I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled*ã pF> with helpful web sites outlining how to use it.ããIt tmux had zmodem support, I would switch, but it doesn't. I am actuallyãusing tmux now to try it out. I actually find it useful for a quick fileãtransfer, its a little more convienient than using SSH or netcat.ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Boraxman to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu May 06 2021 08:04 amãã > -=> poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-ã > ã > pF> @MSGID: <609333BF.2679.dove.dove-nix@realitycheckbbs.org>ã > pF> @REPLY: <60919499.428.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>ã > -=> Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-ã > ã > Ga> The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?ã > ã > pF> <flips coin>ã > ã > pF> I'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on usingã > pF> tmux. Once I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled*ã > pF> with helpful web sites outlining how to use it.ã > ã > It tmux had zmodem support, I would switch, but it doesn't. I am actually using tmã > now to try it out. I actually find it useful for a quick file transfer, its a littã > more convienient than using SSH or netcat.ã > ã > ... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ããI used c-kermit under tmux for a while in order to handle XYZModem stuff for a while.ãIt works ok. Still it looks like the process is a bit more streamlined under screen,ãor that is the memory I have from when I looked into the documentation.ãã--ãgopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalkenãã---ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: poindexter FORTRAN to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 06:59 amãã > -=> Gamgee wrote to All <=-ã > ã > Ga> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã > ã > Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game,ã > playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple ofã > Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.ããHonestly I think you're in a good position. I use screen because I've beenãaround for a while and screen was the first really decent terminalãmultiplexer. The codebase for GNU Screen is pretty gnarly and there's not aãlot of substantial development on it to speak of. tmux has a cleaner (andãsmaller/simpler) codebase and attracts more development.ããI tried tmux once and it was fine. I spent all my time configuration it toãwork like screen and thought "well, this is pointless, I'll just use screen".ãI think if I were coming into it new and didn't have any habits andãmuscle-memory built up, I would start with tmux, though.ããI'll use screen until I need something screen can't do, and then I'll switchãto tmux, I think.ããããã---ã þ Synchronet þ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.netã

Ksource wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-ãã Ks> @MSGID: <60A218E4.5774.dove-nix@cavebbs.homeip.net>ã Ks> @REPLY: <60914C34.2674.dove.dove-nix@realitycheckbbs.org>ã Ks> Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã Ks> By: poindexter FORTRAN to Gamgeeã Ks> on Fri Apr 30 2021 06:59 amãã > -=> Gamgee wrote to All <=-ã >ã > Ga> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã >ã > Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game,ã > playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple ofã > Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.ãã Ks> Honestly I think you're in a good position. I use screen because I'veã Ks> been around for a while and screen was the first really decent terminalã Ks> multiplexer. The codebase for GNU Screen is pretty gnarly and there'sã Ks> not a lot of substantial development on it to speak of. tmux has aã Ks> cleaner (and smaller/simpler) codebase and attracts more development.ãã Ks> I tried tmux once and it was fine. I spent all my time configuration itã Ks> to work like screen and thought "well, this is pointless, I'll just useã Ks> screen". I think if I were coming into it new and didn't have anyã Ks> habits and muscle-memory built up, I would start with tmux, though.ãã Ks> I'll use screen until I need something screen can't do, and then I'llã Ks> switch to tmux, I think.ããI've started trying Tmux in place of Screen, and I like it, but for the mostãpart, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem supportãthat screen has is actually more useful than you think.ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

part, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem suppoã Bo> that screen has is actually more useful than you think.ã Bo> ããFunny - I've used `screen` for years and never come across zmodem support. Iãuse that feature of SecureCRT a lot, to drop files onto my terminal sessionãand upload. I'm guessing this is what screen does as well?! I'll have toãcheck it out. ãã~pvãã--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/08/26 (Linux/64)ã * Origin: Pedalion BBSã

PhazeVektor wrote to Boraxman <=-ãã Ph> @MSGID: <60A53838.11131.dove-lnx@vert.synchro.net>ã Bo> part, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem suppoã Bo> that screen has is actually more useful than you think.ã Bo>ãã Ph> Funny - I've used `screen` for years and never come across zmodemã Ph> support. I use that feature of SecureCRT a lot, to drop files onto myã Ph> terminal session and upload. I'm guessing this is what screen does asã Ph> well?! I'll have to check it out.ããSort of. With screen, you set the zmodem setting to "catch", and when you runã"sz" or "rz" on the remote machine, screen will pick it up, and prompt you toãrun "rz" or "sz" on the local machine. Annoyingly, when you send on the localãmachine, you have to type the path (so it means you have to remember the fullãfilename, there is no selector). But it works. Sometimes you need to add theã'-e' option to escape control sequences.ããSCP is better, but when you are already logged on, then it saves you opening upãanother terminal.ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

On 2021-04-30, Gamgee <gamgee@PALANT> wrote:ã>ã> For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã>ã> Thanks.ã>ã>ã>ã> ... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.ã> --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã> ããTmux user here, because of OpenBSD base and well, I set ãa clonic OpenBSD base under Void Linux, with very closeãconfig and constraints. As a plug, I have framebuffer ãsupport for SDL(2), mplayer, mpv, fbi, fbpdf2 and fbdjvu.ãFor comic books, I use fbi+a script to uncompress the files,ãand for IM, bitlbee+kirc work well, among links,s-nail and ãgetmail. ãI've been weeks without X, and I won't miss it. Groff+Momãtypesets math perfectly, gnuplot is dumb easy and sc-imãand catdoc and/or antiword will do the same on docx/rtf/ ãxls files.ãCurrent games require 16GB of RAM, a 20x more powerful GPUãand a 10x better CPU, so that's a no-no for me.ãSlashem, interactive fiction and mednafen could keep me busyãfor years.ã---ã þ Synchronet þ Vertrauen þ Home of Synchronet þ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.netã

anthk wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã an> @MSGID: <614B942D.11157.dove-lnx@vert.synchro.net>ã an> @REPLY: <608B54B9.392.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>ã an> On 2021-04-30, Gamgee <gamgee@PALANT> wrote:ã >ã > For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?ã >ã > Thanks.ã >ã >ã >ã > ... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.ã > --- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã >ãã an> Tmux user here, because of OpenBSD base and well, I setã an> a clonic OpenBSD base under Void Linux, with very closeã an> config and constraints. As a plug, I have framebufferã an> support for SDL(2), mplayer, mpv, fbi, fbpdf2 and fbdjvu.ã an> For comic books, I use fbi+a script to uncompress the files,ã an> and for IM, bitlbee+kirc work well, among links,s-nail andã an> getmail.ã an> I've been weeks without X, and I won't miss it. Groff+Momã an> typesets math perfectly, gnuplot is dumb easy and sc-imã an> and catdoc and/or antiword will do the same on docx/rtf/ã an> xls files.ã an> Current games require 16GB of RAM, a 20x more powerful GPUã an> and a 10x better CPU, so that's a no-no for me.ã an> Slashem, interactive fiction and mednafen could keep me busyã an> for years.ã an> ã an> ---ããUsing tmux at the moment, but I'm pretty ambivalent about whether I use screenãor tmux. I'm using tmux because the keybindings on how to split a screen areãfresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have a menu set to SSHãinto particular servers, and those shortcuts set up a terminal with screen. ãScreen has ZMODEM support which I do use.ããHowever I've found that systemd now terminates all your processes when you logãout, including detached screen and tmux sessions!ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Boraxman to anthk on Thu Sep 23 2021 05:47 pmãã > screen are fresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have aã > menu set to SSH into particular servers, and those shortcuts set up aã > terminal with screen. Screen has ZMODEM support which I do use.ããhow do you even use zmodem with screen?ãdo you just run it on auto in the screen session?ã---ã þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::ã

MRO wrote to Boraxman <=-ãã MR> @MSGID: <614C9155.779.dove-nix@bbses.info>ã MR> @REPLY: <614C312F.2856.dove-nix@bbs.mozysswamp.org>ã MR> Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã MR> By: Boraxman to anthk on Thu Sep 23 2021 05:47 pmãã > screen are fresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have aã > menu set to SSH into particular servers, and those shortcuts set up aã > terminal with screen. Screen has ZMODEM support which I do use.ããYou enable zmodem with the "zmodem catch" config option. This will detect andãzmodem escape sequences. When it detects one, screen will then prompt you toãrun the corresponding sz/rz command at your end.ããSo how it works is this. You start screen, then ssh/telnet to the remoteãserver. On the remote server you initiate either rz or sz depending on whetherãyou want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a prompt with sz orãrz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you accept that command,ãthe transfer proceeds.ããIts convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send an adhocãfile back or forth.ãã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Boraxman to MRO on Fri Sep 24 2021 03:31 pmãã > whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a promptã > with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you acceptã > that command, the transfer proceeds.ã >ã > Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send anã > adhoc file back or forth.ããoh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to my server.ã---ã þ Synchronet þ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::ã

MRO wrote to Boraxman <=-ãã MR> @MSGID: <614DDFD8.781.dove-nix@bbses.info>ã MR> @REPLY: <614D645B.2858.dove-nix@bbs.mozysswamp.org>ã MR> Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã MR> By: Boraxman to MRO on Fri Sep 24 2021 03:31 pmãã > whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a promptã > with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you acceptã > that command, the transfer proceeds.ã >ã > Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send anã > adhoc file back or forth.ãã MR> oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to myã MR> server. ---ããI use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another shell to runãthe command. Zmodem means I can do it within the shell.ããFor Windows users, you can use LePutty, which is Putty with zmodem support. ãWouldn't have thought it would still be useful, but it is.ããã... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.orgã

Boraxman wrote to MRO <=-ãã > whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a promptã > with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you acceptã > that command, the transfer proceeds.ã >ã > Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send anã > adhoc file back or forth.ãã MR> oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to myã MR> server.ãã Bo> I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting anotherã Bo> shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within theã Bo> shell.ããDid not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just tried ãit and it works perfectly.ããThanks for bringing this up.ãããã... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.ã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to Boraxman on Sat Sep 25 2021 09:55 amãã >> whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up aã >> prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. ã >> When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.ãã >> Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want toã >> send an adhoc file back or forth.ãã MR>> oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files toã MR>> my server.ãã Bo>> I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting anotherã Bo>> shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within theã Bo>> shell.ãã Ga> Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just tried ã Ga> it and it works perfectly.ãã I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free, but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and organize over a thousand different servers.ããDaiTenguãã... She drowned at the end of her life.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.comã

DaiTengu wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Bo>> I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting anotherã Bo>> shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within theã Bo>> shell.ãã Ga> Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just triedã Ga> it and it works perfectly.ãã Da> I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp guiã Da> where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free,ã Da> but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with andã Da> organize over a thousand different servers.ããThankfully, Windows is not something I have to deal with.ãããã... If it weren't for Edison we'd be using computers by candlelightã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FLã

DaiTengu wrote to Gamgee <=-ãã Da> I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui whereã Da> you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free, but it'sã Da> well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and organize overã Da> a thousand different servers.ããI'll have to take another look at MobaXTerm. We're using a combination of ãPutty, WinSCP and an autologin plugin for Keepass that's nice.ããKeys most places to autologin, and Keepass to automate SSH/RDP elsewhere.ããI wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and share them, ãwe have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of the usual hosts ãwhen I image systems for them.ããã... Magnify the most difficult detailsã--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.ã

Hello poindexter;ãã-=> poindexter FORTRAN wrote to DaiTengu <=-ãã Da> It's not freeããI've used it in the past and my copies were free. They requested you purchasedãit of course but it wasn't crippled. ãã pF> I'll have to take another look at MobaXTerm. We're using a combinationã pF> of Putty, WinSCP and an autologin plugin for Keepass that's nice.ããOf course, you can write your own shell script I'm sure. Perhaps rsync may beãof assistance?ããã... Quarks DO IT, but they only get 1/3 of a charge out of itã--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ SBBS - Carnage! sudo -s; rm -rf / ;-)ã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: Gamgee to DaiTengu on Sat Sep 25 2021 08:40 pmãã Bo>>> I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting anotherã Bo>>> shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within theã Bo>>> shell.ãã Ga>> Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Justã Ga>> tried it and it works perfectly.ãã Da>> I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp guiã Da>> where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free,ã Da>> but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with andã Da>> organize over a thousand different servers.ãã Ga> Thankfully, Windows is not something I have to deal with.ããã I use Windows on my primary computer, as I play video games, and a lot of the ham radio stuff I have also requires windows (getting any of that stuff to run reliably under WINE is a nightmare I don't want to deal with).ããThe other 6 computers sitting around me are all running some flavor of Linux, and one runs BSD. ããDaiTenguãã... A bachelor never makes the same mistake once.ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.comã

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?ã By: poindexter FORTRAN to DaiTengu on Sun Sep 26 2021 10:53 amãã PF> I wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and share them,ã PF> we have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of the usual hosts ã PF> when I image systems for them.ãã It should be pretty easy to create a web page with links to all the servers people need to access. a browser can auto-launch PuTTY. They'd just need to make sure their key was loaded.ããDaiTenguãã... But soft, what light through yonder tagline breaks?ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.comã

DaiTengu wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-ãã Da> It should be pretty easy to create a web page with links to all theã Da> servers people need to access. a browser can auto-launch PuTTY. They'dã Da> just need to make sure their key was loaded.ããI've been playing with Dashy on my home lab; I've got a destination web page ãat work on our outward-facing reverse proxy that could easily be a web page ãinside the firewall, accessible via VPN. That might be a nice project.ããã... Observe the procedures of a general alert. ã--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52ã þ Synchronet þ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.ã

Quoting poindexter FORTRAN to DaiTengu <=-ãã pF> I wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and shareã pF> them, we have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of theã pF> usual hosts when I image systems for them.ããIt's been a while, but you may be able to copy the settings from aãsubdirectory of %localappdata% or %programdata%, then propagate them toãthe other systems in whatever your favorite method is.ããJazzy Jãããã * AmyBW v2.16 *ã... Afraid of speed? Use Windows!ãã---ã þ Synchronet þ BayouBBS.Net, Ports 23, 6401 and 6402ã